[Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Lissner, L S. (Scott ) lissner.2 at osu.edu
Thu Dec 19 17:08:29 PST 2013


Ron

I am about as low techs you can get and still post to this list from a phone but I thought the issue started with a change in Microsoft log in page

----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Stewart [mailto:ron at ahead.org]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 05:19 PM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network' <athen-list at u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Thanks Scott,

Unfortunately the Apple OS and Google Chrome issue cannot be fixed by
Microsoft as far as I am aware of. They need to be fixed by their owners,
which I do not see happening anytime soon. This is when IHE's as customers
need to step up to the plate and demand truly usable and accessible products
from our vendors. Until that happens my guess we are going to see the
continuation of a segregationist IT environment with the customers footing
the bill to develop workarounds.

Ron

-----Original Message-----
From: athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu
[mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Lissner,
L S. (Scott )
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 4:03 PM
To: 'athen-list at u.washington.edu'
Subject: Re: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

I agree with Ron, the fixes help as a stop gap but they will not meet the
substantially equivalent ease of use criteria that DOJ and Education are
using in the long term; we need a real fix from Microsoft with all possible
speed.

----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Stewart [mailto:ron at ahead.org]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 04:47 PM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network'
<athen-list at u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Thank this reflects my experience as well. My response has more to do with
our legal responsibility for equal and equivalent access than anything else.
To require this level of additional work is not equivalent in my mind, and
given the very basic AT skills students have with their AT is also not
acceptable under the applicable law as I understand it. The non VoiceOver
support is particularly problematic.

Ron Stewart

-----Original Message-----
From: athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu
[mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Bossley,
Peter A. (Pete)
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 2:54 PM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network
Subject: RE: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

You can restore the vanilla prompt in IE by accessing the developer tools by
pressing F12, clicking or activating the cache menu, and selecting clear
browser cache for this domain, clear session cookies, clear cookies for this
domain.
Unfortunately you have to do this every time.
Our MS rep claims he will get back in touch with us. Ken or I will report
when/if that happens. I won't hold my breath.

--
Peter Bossley
OCIO Accessibility Analyst
The Ohio State University
Office of the Chief Information Officer Enterprise Applications
226 ADC, 2740 Airport Drive, Columbus, OH 43219
(614) 292-8571 Office
bossley.5 at osu.edu ocio.osu.edu



-----Original Message-----
From: athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu
[mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Ron
Stewart
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 3:36 PM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network'
Subject: RE: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Hi all,

Having been forced to work with the Office 365 system for much longer than I
would have liked to what I found was that you need to flush the cache on
your browser almost every time you attempted to connect to it. I was not
using a screen reader but was moving from device to device as my life moved
from one role to another. Given this does not make sense, but the most
problematic device I had was my IPAD, which Ken has already indicated as
problematic since VO provides no support, which is typical of MS products.

My current conclusions, and those I am providing to my clients, is that they
do not require this of their users who use AT. While it may not give you
the ability to access MS applications there are fully accessible
alternatives available that will. Not a great answer but it seems to be the
only one that is currently viable. From an accessibility perspective the
Office 365 interface is marginally accessible in MS browsers, marginally
accessible in no MS based browsers. Totally inaccessible in the Mac systems
and even more problematic in the Google Chrome system.

Given our obligations under the law, how could we ever begin to support this
kind of broad scale implementation. If I as a visual person had such issues
and a screen reader user cannot use the system it would seem to me to be
very problematic.

Ron Stewart

-----Original Message-----
From: athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu
[mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of
McGinnity, Julie A. (MU-Student)
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 1:52 PM
To: petri.1 at osu.edu
Cc: Access Technology Higher Education Network
Subject: RE: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login


________________________________________
From: kennpetri at gmail.com [kennpetri at gmail.com] on behalf of Ken Petri
[petri.1 at osu.edu]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 1:16 PM
To: McGinnity, Julie A. (MU-Student)
Cc: Access Technology Higher Education Network
Subject: Re: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Julie,

Interestingly, MS Narrator + IE (Win 8) had no problem with the login. Go
figure. Mac VoiceOver users appear to be totally out of luck -- I'd be
interested to hear of others have had experience with Mac + VoiceOver,
especially.

We were able to use JAWS and NVDA in pass-through mode. I'll have to check
on versions and browser combinations. But that is our current work-around:
JAWS-KEY + z or NVDA-KEY + space bar and then tab to the "organizational
login" announcement and press Enter to have focus put into the password
field.

If that one doesn't pan out in further testing, the alternative is to clear
the browser cookies and cache and reload, which returns you to the "first
timer" login screen. I'm hoping to avoid that "solution," as it's a serious
hassle.

It's a bad situation and one that Microsoft really should fix immediately.



On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 1:27 PM, McGinnity, Julie A. (MU-Student)
<jamzk7 at mail.missouri.edu<mailto:jamzk7 at mail.missouri.edu>> wrote:
Thank you for this. It fits perfectly with what we found as well. Even in
pass through mode with Jaws 14, I could not get the form field to show up.

We also found that the mouse would not even access the forms when Jaws was
on. I would love to view any work-arounds that you have devised.
________________________________________
From:
athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailm
an2.u.washington.edu>
[athen-list-bounces at mailman2.u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list-bounces at mail
man2.u.washington.edu>] on behalf of Ken Petri
[petri.1 at osu.edu<mailto:petri.1 at osu.edu>]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 9:14 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network; CIC IT Accessibility
Usability Group
Subject: [Athen] Login problems with Microsoft 365 login

Ohio State students use Microsoft's hosted email system. (Faculty and staff
use a local Exchange instance.) The service for students that we call
Buckeyemail was upgraded by Microsoft earlier this week to keep it in line
with the MS 365 product.

We found that, once you had logged in once and your browser recognized your
organizational email address, subsequent logins with the same browser gave
you a login interface that was not (easily) accessible to screen reader
users. The organizational login button is not clickable using a screen
reader, unless you put the screen reader into pass-through mode -- something
that we felt our students would be unlikely to discover on their own.

We have put a notification up on our Buckeyemail/email selection page, here:

https://email.osu.edu/

Right now users are directed to contact our help line, but in the next day
or so we will be adding a link to a knowledge base article that explains how
to work around the issue. We are also in contact with MS through our campus
rep.

If your campus uses 365 for student or other email, your screen reader users
may be affected.

Note that keyboard only users are not affected. Note also that we could not
get VoiceOver on Mac to work with the login interface at all.

The problem is only apparent after you have logged in once and your browser
sets the cookie to remember your username for subsequent logins.

Best,

ken





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