[Athen] Athen Digest, Vol 15, Issue 40

Saroj Primlani saroj_primlani at ncsu.edu
Wed Apr 25 11:32:30 PDT 2007


The answer to the questions raised is yes to the first two questions. The
challenge to creating a screen reader that will correctly phrase the short
forms and speak the language would be the challenge. If they are
interested, I have an Iranian Blind student who may be interested in working
with them on it.
Saroj

_________________________________
Saroj Primlani
Coordinator of University IT Accessibility
ITD
919 513 4087
http://ncsu.edu/it/access


-----Original Message-----
From: athen-bounces at athenpro.org [mailto:athen-bounces at athenpro.org] On
Behalf Of athen-request at athenpro.org
Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 2:15 PM
To: athen at athenpro.org
Subject: Athen Digest, Vol 15, Issue 40

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Today's Topics:

1. ok one more question (Jean Salzer)
2. Re: more than one question! (Travis Roth)
3. Re: more than one question! (Terry Thompson)
4. Re: more than one question! (John Gardner)
5. Re: more than one question! (Nusen, Michael)
6. Re: International students who are blind (Dina Rosenbaum)
7. anyone have experience in real-time captioning (Alice Anderson)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 14:02:58 -0500
From: Jean Salzer <jeano at uwm.edu>
Subject: [Athen] ok one more question
To: Access Technologists in Higher Education Network
<Athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <462E5462.2080900 at uwm.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

A suggestion question that was posed at the meeting previously mentioned
was about a CRT that is tactile/tactual? I have a vague recollection of
such a piece of softare, equipment from the 2000 AHEAD conference vendor
session, but don't recall seeing anything since then...

Anyone?
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 14:07:24 -0500
From: "Travis Roth" <travis at travisroth.com>
Subject: Re: [Athen] more than one question!
To: <jeano at uwm.edu>, "'Access Technologists in Higher Education
Network'" <athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <00f101c786a3$cb60abd0$8119fea9 at latitude>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi,

As for question 3:
"Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their principle
goal with regard to completing this degree is to create a screen reading
system similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides connecting with
Freedom Scientific, are there any other suggestions for achievement of
this goal besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a
software engineering program?"

They of course could start from scratch.
Depending on the study program and its goals, I'd suggest that they and
their instructors evaluate adding this goal as a task to an existing
open-source project.

For example, an open source screen reader for Gnome (runs on Linux) is
called Orca. Orca is written primarily in Python, and takes advantage of the
accessibility API in Gnome. Find more info at http://live.gnome.org/Orca .

Another recently launched open-source screen reading project for Windows is
called Nonvisual Desktop Access (NVDA).
http://www.kulgan.net/nvda/


-----Original Message-----
From: Jean Salzer [mailto:jeano at uwm.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 1:56 PM
To: athen at athenpro.org
Subject: [Athen] more than one question!


Hi all,

I just met with some folks from a small, private college in the area.
They are interested in learning more about how colleges have
accommodated totally blind students with computer science majors. We had
some discussion of assistive technology, however, part of their concern
is the world of windows and graphics versus just 'code'.

Question #1 - is there anyone out there who has been able to accommodate
a qualified blind student through a 4-year degree program for software
engineering?

Question #2 - how well can the Tiger embosser and software work with
Jaws so the students can create tactile representations of the graphics
they'll need for coursework completion?

Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their principle
goal with regard to completing this degree is to create a screen reading
system similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides connecting with
Freedom Scientific, are there any other suggestions for achievement of
this goal besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a
software engineering program?

Thanks in advance.




------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 12:39:53 -0700
From: "Terry Thompson" <tft at u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: [Athen] more than one question!
To: "'Access Technologists in Higher Education Network'"
<athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <200704241939.l3OJdsUu002688 at smtp.washington.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

In addition to those Travis mentioned, here are a couple more open source
screen reader projects the students should be aware of:

Thunder
http://www.screenreader.net/

Firevox (not a full-blown screen reader, but a talking browser extension)
http://firevox.clcworld.net/about.html

Terry Thompson
Technology Specialist, DO-IT
University of Washington
tft at u.washington.edu
206/221-4168
http://www.washington.edu/doit


> -----Original Message-----

> From: athen-bounces at athenpro.org

> [mailto:athen-bounces at athenpro.org] On Behalf Of Travis Roth

> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 12:07 PM

> To: jeano at uwm.edu; 'Access Technologists in Higher Education Network'

> Subject: Re: [Athen] more than one question!

>

> Hi,

>

> As for question 3:

> "Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their

> principle goal with regard to completing this degree is to

> create a screen reading system similar to Jaws in Pakistani

> languages. Besides connecting with Freedom Scientific, are

> there any other suggestions for achievement of this goal

> besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a

> software engineering program?"

>

> They of course could start from scratch.

> Depending on the study program and its goals, I'd suggest

> that they and their instructors evaluate adding this goal as

> a task to an existing open-source project.

>

> For example, an open source screen reader for Gnome (runs on

> Linux) is called Orca. Orca is written primarily in Python,

> and takes advantage of the accessibility API in Gnome. Find

> more info at http://live.gnome.org/Orca .

>

> Another recently launched open-source screen reading project

> for Windows is called Nonvisual Desktop Access (NVDA).

> http://www.kulgan.net/nvda/

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Jean Salzer [mailto:jeano at uwm.edu]

> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 1:56 PM

> To: athen at athenpro.org

> Subject: [Athen] more than one question!

>

>

> Hi all,

>

> I just met with some folks from a small, private college in the area.

> They are interested in learning more about how colleges have

> accommodated totally blind students with computer science

> majors. We had

> some discussion of assistive technology, however, part of

> their concern

> is the world of windows and graphics versus just 'code'.

>

> Question #1 - is there anyone out there who has been able to

> accommodate

> a qualified blind student through a 4-year degree program for

> software

> engineering?

>

> Question #2 - how well can the Tiger embosser and software work with

> Jaws so the students can create tactile representations of

> the graphics

> they'll need for coursework completion?

>

> Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their

> principle

> goal with regard to completing this degree is to create a

> screen reading

> system similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides

> connecting with

> Freedom Scientific, are there any other suggestions for

> achievement of

> this goal besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous

> years in a

> software engineering program?

>

> Thanks in advance.

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> Athen mailing list

> Athen at athenpro.org

> http://athenpro.org/mailman/listinfo/athen_athenpro.org

>





------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 14:49:05 -0700
From: "John Gardner" <john.gardner at orst.edu>
Subject: Re: [Athen] more than one question!
To: <jeano at uwm.edu>, "'Access Technologists in Higher Education
Network'" <athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <004501c786ba$616e3500$a11919ac at johnz>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hello Jean, the answer to your first question is "yes", there have been
many blind students complete BS degrees in computer science or software
engineering. It hasn't been easy for most, but things are improving
somewhat.

The answer to your second question is yes as well, although a blind person
needs more than a Tiger embosser to gain access to graphics. She needs to
use IVEO in conjunction with that embosser, and occasionally may need some
additional assistance from a sighted editor for really complex graphics.
However a dedicated blind person can access most graphics without
assistance, particularly the kinds of graphics common in computer science,
physics, and mathematics. I know - I do it all the time. On the scale of
access technologies, IVEO is a real bargain. ViewPlus sells the authoring
software (IVEO Creator) and a touchpad for $1000. With that combination one
can create and read accessible IVEO SVG files from any computer application,
import from PDF, import from bit maps, and scan in from paper documents.
Pardon me for this self-promotion, but since this is the answer you were
hoping for, I presume you forgive me.

Several people have already answered your final question. I agree that it's
worth keeping up with open source developments. However Terry is mistaken
about Thunder. Although Paul Blenkhorn, Thunder author, has a rather
different business model from most, Thunder is not open source. I'll guess
he's be open to collaboration for making Thunder work in Pakistan though.

John





-----Original Message-----
From: athen-bounces at athenpro.org [mailto:athen-bounces at athenpro.org] On
Behalf Of Jean Salzer
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 11:56 AM
To: athen at athenpro.org
Subject: [Athen] more than one question!

Hi all,

I just met with some folks from a small, private college in the area.
They are interested in learning more about how colleges have accommodated
totally blind students with computer science majors. We had some discussion
of assistive technology, however, part of their concern is the world of
windows and graphics versus just 'code'.

Question #1 - is there anyone out there who has been able to accommodate a
qualified blind student through a 4-year degree program for software
engineering?

Question #2 - how well can the Tiger embosser and software work with Jaws so
the students can create tactile representations of the graphics they'll need
for coursework completion?

Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their principle goal
with regard to completing this degree is to create a screen reading system
similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides connecting with Freedom
Scientific, are there any other suggestions for achievement of this goal
besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a software
engineering program?

Thanks in advance.




------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 16:21:50 -0600
From: "Nusen, Michael" <Michael.Nusen at ppcc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Athen] more than one question!
To: "Access Technologists in Higher Education Network"
<athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID:
<0B6DCE7FD0CAC8499F3F32584186A32504C3854F at ppcca1.ppcc.ccofc.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

RE Ques #3: the below posting is from
http://pakistaniat.com/2007/02/27/pakistan-internet-cafe-computer-softwa
re-for-the-blind-disabled/

Aqil Sajjad
Feb 27th, 2007 at 4:49 pm Quote
Thanks for this post Bilal.

However, I must clarify that my mention as the person who introduced the
software to Pakistan is not accurate. I was just one of the first people
to use it in Islamabad (simply because I was fortunate enough to have
the means to buy it), and naturally, people needing info about screen
reading software were often directed to me for their queries. So my name
just got mentioned rather undeservingly in that daily times report.

Anyway, the latest on the internet cafe is that it's up and running.
They are developing some training manuals for Jaws with instructions in
Urdu, which is really helpful for those who may not be too comfortable
with English. The response has been encouraging, and they are even
considering the possibility of holding some training workshops in other
cities once in a while.

Urdu software: yes, this is indeed a huge problem; what I understand
with my discussion with some cs people is that it's going to take a
while before we have an urdu speech program. The problem has to do with
the way Urdu is written, especially the fact that it does not have
vowels. But yes, I do hope that enough resources and effort is put into
it.

Eidee man, the open source community has not had much input in jaws and
windows eyes. These are purely commercial programs.
WinTriangle has been made an open source program, but not much has come
of it. So it remains the rather crude program that it has been for the
last 3-4 years or so, with a lot of room for improvement.

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: athen-bounces at athenpro.org [mailto:athen-bounces at athenpro.org] On
Behalf Of Jean Salzer
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 12:56 PM
To: athen at athenpro.org
Subject: [Athen] more than one question!

Hi all,

I just met with some folks from a small, private college in the area.
They are interested in learning more about how colleges have
accommodated totally blind students with computer science majors. We had
some discussion of assistive technology, however, part of their concern
is the world of windows and graphics versus just 'code'.

Question #1 - is there anyone out there who has been able to accommodate
a qualified blind student through a 4-year degree program for software
engineering?

Question #2 - how well can the Tiger embosser and software work with
Jaws so the students can create tactile representations of the graphics
they'll need for coursework completion?

Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their principle
goal with regard to completing this degree is to create a screen reading
system similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides connecting with
Freedom Scientific, are there any other suggestions for achievement of
this goal besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a
software engineering program?

Thanks in advance.



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 11:20:05 -0400
From: Dina Rosenbaum <dina.rosenbaum at carroll.org>
Subject: Re: [Athen] International students who are blind
To: Access Technologists in Higher Education Network
<athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <462F71A5.20102 at carroll.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Most of the development of this type of software development has been
done in India. Students who have an interest like this should contact
the India Association for the Blind to see what is already being
done/development. There is braille translation software for Pakistan
(Duxbury) and Dolphin Systems from England has speech programs in
several languages.

Robert Shelton --you can google him--is a NASA scientist who is blind,
and there are many scientists at major universities who are blind,
including MIT.

However, blind persons in Pakistan are not typically rehabilitated like
they are in the US. For example, they might be able to travel
independently, or live independently (ie, family take care of them, and
sight guide them everywhere--no sidewalks to walk independently so no
need for independent travel skills, etc). So these might be greater
issues than their academic abilities.

John Gardner wrote:

> Hello Jean, the answer to your first question is "yes", there have been

> many blind students complete BS degrees in computer science or software

> engineering. It hasn't been easy for most, but things are improving

> somewhat.

>

> The answer to your second question is yes as well, although a blind person

> needs more than a Tiger embosser to gain access to graphics. She needs to

> use IVEO in conjunction with that embosser, and occasionally may need some

> additional assistance from a sighted editor for really complex graphics.

> However a dedicated blind person can access most graphics without

> assistance, particularly the kinds of graphics common in computer science,

> physics, and mathematics. I know - I do it all the time. On the scale of

> access technologies, IVEO is a real bargain. ViewPlus sells the authoring

> software (IVEO Creator) and a touchpad for $1000. With that combination

one

> can create and read accessible IVEO SVG files from any computer

application,

> import from PDF, import from bit maps, and scan in from paper documents.

> Pardon me for this self-promotion, but since this is the answer you were

> hoping for, I presume you forgive me.

>

> Several people have already answered your final question. I agree that

it's

> worth keeping up with open source developments. However Terry is mistaken

> about Thunder. Although Paul Blenkhorn, Thunder author, has a rather

> different business model from most, Thunder is not open source. I'll

guess

> he's be open to collaboration for making Thunder work in Pakistan though.

>

> John

>

>

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: athen-bounces at athenpro.org [mailto:athen-bounces at athenpro.org] On

> Behalf Of Jean Salzer

> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 11:56 AM

> To: athen at athenpro.org

> Subject: [Athen] more than one question!

>

> Hi all,

>

> I just met with some folks from a small, private college in the area.

> They are interested in learning more about how colleges have accommodated

> totally blind students with computer science majors. We had some

discussion

> of assistive technology, however, part of their concern is the world of

> windows and graphics versus just 'code'.

>

> Question #1 - is there anyone out there who has been able to accommodate a

> qualified blind student through a 4-year degree program for software

> engineering?

>

> Question #2 - how well can the Tiger embosser and software work with Jaws

so

> the students can create tactile representations of the graphics they'll

need

> for coursework completion?

>

> Question #3 - the students are siblings from Pakistan. Their principle

goal

> with regard to completing this degree is to create a screen reading system

> similar to Jaws in Pakistani languages. Besides connecting with Freedom

> Scientific, are there any other suggestions for achievement of this goal

> besides them doing it themselves after 4-5 arduous years in a software

> engineering program?

>

> Thanks in advance.

>

>

> _______________________________________________

> Athen mailing list

> Athen at athenpro.org

> http://athenpro.org/mailman/listinfo/athen_athenpro.org

>

>

>


--
Dina Rosenbaum
Carroll Center for the BLind
770 Centre St, Newton, MA 02459
800-852-3131
www.carroll.org
www.carrolltech.org





------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 13:14:51 -0500
From: Alice Anderson <alice.anderson at doit.wisc.edu>
Subject: [Athen] anyone have experience in real-time captioning
To: Access Technologists in Higher Education Network
<athen at athenpro.org>
Message-ID: <BAD6AA9A-E3B7-4295-8983-1EED219852C0 at doit.wisc.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed

ATHEN,

Has anyone used real time captioning services for a live event -
e.g., graduation ...

and what has been your experience (quality, reliability, costs) or
recommendations...

thanks much,
Alice






Alice Anderson, Director
MIDWEST Alliance for Science,Technology, Engineering and Math
www.stemmidwest.org

and

Technology Accessibility Program (TAP)
Division of Information Technology (DoIT)
University of Wisconsin-Madison
1210 West Dayton Street (3124)
Madison, WI 53705
http://www.doit.wisc.edu/accessibility/
Telephone: 608.262.2129










------------------------------

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Athen mailing list
Athen at athenpro.org
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End of Athen Digest, Vol 15, Issue 40
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