[Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

[Preast, Vanessa]

I’m a bit confused by the different recommendations. How do we know what is the best practice?

The Alt text area within Word has both a Title field and Description field. I’m hearing different recommendations on what needs to be filled out, even in this thread.

It sounds like WebAIM<http://webaim.org/techniques/word/#altText> and NCDAE<http://ncdae.org/resources/cheatsheets/word.php> recommend writing in the Description. At least one specifically indicates leaving Title blank. Yet some others, including Microsoft, are indicating that we should be filling in both. Though one Microsoft document indicates using title only if the description is long<https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Add-alternative-text-to-a-shape-picture-chart-table-SmartArt-graphic-or-other-object-44989B2A-903C-4D9A-B742-6A75B451C669#bm14> there is another Microsoft document suggests both should be completed<https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Make-your-Word-documents-accessible-d9bf3683-87ac-47ea-b91a-78dcacb3c66d>.

I’ve also seen conflicting information about what to do for null items ranging from leaving it blank (which triggers the accessibility checker) to using “” which seems to also cause problems.
[screenshot of Alt text area]




From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Leyna Bencomo
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:48 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

I do a lot of training of staff and faculty.  I find its best to keep consistent with our recommendations.  I agree with Karen that we must keep recommending that alt-text boxes be filled in.  I generally ask them to fill out both title and description fields.  If some AT works on one or the other or both, at least we’ve got our bases covered.  They don’t need to know that Software X, version X doesn’t necessarily work right now.  I deal with those issues on a one-on-one basis with my blind students.   It simplifies my classes for me and keeps the faculty/staff on a consistent track.  I don’t want to do anything to de-motivate them!


Leyna Bencomo
Assistive Technology Specialist
Information Technology
University of Colorado Colorado Springs
1420 Austin Bluffs Parkway, EPC 215
Colorado Springs, CO 80918
(719) 255-4202 / lbencomo at uccs.edu<mailto:lbencomo at uccs.edu>
http://www.uccs.edu/~it/
[uccs-signature-email]



From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Robert Beach
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:33 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

Interesting that you say this.  I ran a test yesterday when this topic came up.  I added an image and added both a title and alt text to it.  With JAWS 17, only the title was read, not the alt text.  When I added an image with just alt text and no title, then the alt test was read.

Hmmm, “It gets curiousier and curiousier.”


Robert Lee Beach
Assistive Technology Specialist
Kansas City Kansas Community College
7250 State Avenue
Kansas City, KS  66112
Phone: 913-288-7671
Email: rbeach at kckcc.edu<mailto:rbeach at kckcc.edu>

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Karlen Communications
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:25 AM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network' <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

JAWS 18 IS reading the Alt text of images in PowerPoint…so far.

I typically don’t use the Title attribute in Office documents. I don’t know of an adaptive technology that supports it and if I don’t add the Title, the accessibility Checker doesn’t catch it.

If we want the Title attribute supported then we need to advocate for the support but I think Alt Text is enough for images in Office documents. If we get support for the Title attribute, then we have to identify what type of text to put in it and how will that be different from or enhance Alt text. We also have to decide when or if to add the Title attribute. If we don’t “need” it will it get flagged by the Accessibility Checker? If adaptive technology consistently does read the Alt Text attribute (with the exception of bugs that appear in a specific build or version), then do we really need the Title attribute?

BTW, if you try to put null Alt Text in an Office document, you end up with us hearing “graphic, quote, quote” or “Graphic quote, space, quote” and when you convert the document to tagged PDF, the image is not converted to an Artifact, we still hear that Alt Text of “graphic, quote, quote.” The word graphic is added by the adaptive technology to let us know that we are on an image.

Some techniques don’t transfer to other formats. Office-type documents have no concept of Artifacts or null Alt Text.  Sort of like trying to make your house a boat by giving it an anchor and a chain. ☺

Cheers, Karen

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Kressin, Lori L. (llk2t)
Sent: February 22, 2017 10:37 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

Hi Karen,

Would this be true of PowerPoint as well?

What does the “Title” field do?

Thanks so much for all of your guidance!

Lori

On 2/22/17, 10:34 AM, "athen-list on behalf of Karlen Communications" <athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu> on behalf of info at karlencommunications.com<mailto:info at karlencommunications.com>> wrote:

Yes, this is what I continue to train on and advise. We

Cheers, Karen

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Preast, Vanessa
Sent: February 22, 2017 10:06 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

So, it would be acceptable and accurate to continue to make the following recommendation regarding adding alt text when building Word documents?

1.       Select image
2.       Right click image and select “Format picture…” (Alt + JP, O)
3.       Select “Layout & Properties”
4.       Go to “Alt text”
5.       Leave Title field blank
6.       In the Description field, add a concise description of the image

Thanks,
Vanessa

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Karlen Communications
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 7:22 AM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network' <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

We have to continue to add the Alt Text for images. JAWS is not the only adaptive technology being used by people. There are other screen readers and Text-to-Speech tools that can access the Alt text. We have to focus on the best practices/standards, and not a specific adaptive technology where a tool/feature might be broken from one version to another. Also, as indicated by someone, the reading of Alt text is working for them using the same version of JAWS, so this may be a device problem or something else that is going on.

Bottom line is that we make documents as accessible as they can be using the tools in the document format/application and when something breaks from one version to another, we let the adaptive technology developers know and lobby for getting it fixed.

In this case, even though JAWS is not reading the Alt Text for the images in a Word document, if I press Ctrl + Shift + letter O, I get a list of objects and the images are listed by their Alt Text. It is just when I go through the document in a logical manner that the problem surfaces.

Cheers, Karen

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Preast, Vanessa
Sent: February 22, 2017 8:05 AM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

If this is the case…. How does this change our recommendations/instructions for alt text in Word?

I’m about to distribute some instructions to our institution on how to add Alt text to Word document images. I want to make sure my instructions are accurate and functional.

Should I tell them to add the description in 1) The title, 2) the description box, or 3) both?  Until this point, it sounded like #2 is what most accessibility experts are recommending.

Best,
Vanessa

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Karlen Communications
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:35 PM
To: 'Access Technology Higher Education Network' <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

Yes, in my case JAWS 18 either says nothing or says “question” when it comes across an image with Alt Text…so not in your imagination…it isn’t consistently reading the Alt text.

Cheers, Karen

From: athen-list [mailto:athen-list-bounces at mailman13.u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Joseph Sherman
Sent: February 21, 2017 1:02 PM
To: Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list at u.washington.edu<mailto:athen-list at u.washington.edu>>
Subject: [Athen] Word 2016 and JAWS/NVDA Image ALT text

In Word 2016, using JAWS 18 standard settings, JAWS will not read the ALT text that is in the Description box. If there is text in the description box it simply reads “Blank”. It will read text in the Title box if it exists.

NVDA on the other hand, will read text in the Description box, and only read Title box if no Description exists.

Am I doing something wrong or is this a JAWS bug?

Joseph

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